(Ep.71) Who Is Rufus Thornton Pt.1

Chuck: 0:11

Welcome back to a brand new episode of let's Just Talk About it podcast. I'm your host, chuck, and if you're here for the first time, this platform was created to give genuine people just like you an opportunity to share a portion of your life's journey. So, with that being said, I'm excited to have special guest Rufus Thornton on with me today, where he shares his experience growing up in the county of Colquitt, Georgia, and he also talks about his experience with the military prison and what he's up to now as a CDL instructor. So, you don't want to miss part one of an amazing two-part conversation called who Is Rufus Thornton? As a matter of fact, do me a favor Go and grab your husband, your wife, your children, or even call a friend and listen into my conversation with Rufus on let's Just Talk About it podcast. Hey, let's jump right in. Welcome back to another episode of let's Just Talk About it podcast Today. I have Rufus Thornton on with me today. How you are doing today, man.

Rufus Thornton: 1:08

I'm blessed brother. How about yourself, man?

Chuck: 1:10

Doing good man. Thank you for agreeing to come on with me. Man, thank you for having me, brother, yeah man, I love to jump right into my conversations, to have those genuine dialogues with genuine people just like yourself, rufus, just to share a portion of your life's journey. And I always say you never know who's listening gonna listen to this episode, so you may be helping somebody who's listening, man. So, with that being said, where you from?

Rufus Thornton: 1:35

Man. I'm from a small town in southwest Georgia called Colquitt, Georgia. Some people say Colquitt C-O-L-Q-U-I-T-T man. One of them country boys.

Chuck: 1:43

Got you. Wow, yeah, how is that for you growing up down there in Georgia?

Rufus Thornton: 1:49

It was a blessing, and a curse depends on what you're connected to, things like me being 51,. I was born in the early 70s, coming up through a time where I was fortunate enough to be raised around a grandmother and grandfather that believed in instilling no values. Yeah, yeah, you know them are good days when your family come to visit man. It wasn't all about your present, it wasn't about your cousin coming from up New York and everybody sleeping on floor in front of the fireplace and saying to. The children got to go in the back and we didn't know why we had to go in the back of grown folks doing grown folks things. You know what I'm saying. So then you go into the 80s man where you're a teenager and then they got this new epidemic of AIDS and drugs and parents had to fight harder to get our hard heads in there. But we was intrigued by a lot of things that were going on and we were challenged with things. In the 80s Got you it wasn't like now to where you had to do a lot of sneaking and doing it, but it was more brotherly, like you can sell drugs and you ain't got to worry about nobody telling on you what's wrong. But you had a different type environment and now, which made it more dangerous because now you get to feed more of your people that poison because it's cool. Now it's a difference, because it's more normal in society to smoke weed and son of your parents or be out there and they legalize in it and all that that. So you still can do it freely. But at the same time it's no longer your brotherhood doing it. To where it's the thing, where grown folks and children. Now it's everybody collectively. Before it was children go do children thing, now it's children doing it, grown folks doing it. So you know, man, being from a small town, you get a chance to see a lot with racism. Where I'm from man, you get to see different views of racism. It was my mom used to work for this guy doing house service that was a member of the clan. I didn't know about it, bro Tell. I moved away in my late teens to another school. You know really what it was. I actually seen them marching my hometown and I wave at them like they were running McDonald's. I'm like, oh, they in the parade, not knowing.

Chuck: 3:56

They had my sense of it.

Rufus Thornton: 3:59

Yeah, they had them on in my town. Man, they will walk through in the parade and you have people come by the high school kid. It was just as normal as anything else, but at the same time, the seriousness of it. I didn't look at it like that because my mom worked for one and I found out, not because he was one of those, because when he was out there with them he must have been hooded up, but I was helping her clean his house one day and I looked in the closet and I seen his. Yeah, I saw it, I saw the whole outfit and I actually shoot like you ain't supposed to be in there, come on up out of there. But the same man, you know, would do things such as give us his leftovers. And growing up in a family like that, where single mom and you know I got relatives and parents, but you know he gave us the leftovers and shoot, we thought it was cool, you know, and to be honest, you know, to the day I think he's cool and he's a clan member. It's just, even today, what I think about is that, regardless if you're a blood crib clan, your heart is what dictates who you are. I had to learn that, being a country boy, you know what I'm saying. So when my mother tried to retire, I was in prison fast forward and a little past experience. But referring to this particular white gentleman, they were giving us all kind of problem. My mom worked for the school system for 30 years and I see my mom seen up on it with my friends. I went through phases in life when I say your mom, she ended up that poop and all that and I knew retirement me being in the army at the time. And then no, I wasn't in prison, I was in the army, I was overseas in Germany. Well, they were giving my brothers and sisters All kind of problems about letting my mom retire. Now she don't need to retire. My mom done such a good job there, she knew all the things that need to happen as far as being the lead janitorial woman at that school. Um, we couldn't get anything done. I mean, she tried for years and he stepped in and interceded and said, um, once he found out about it and she wasn't even working for him really that much anymore, but he stepped in and he got my mom retired.

Chuck: 5:51

The benefits that she was rightfully serving up.

Rufus Thornton: 5:53

And this was a clan member, you know, what I'm saying, but you know part of that will be my testimony. What I probably share, it's um who you connected to and how you connected to him and people are in your life full of faith, but don't let your outside surroundings um put smoke screens um in your face so you can't see what's really going on.

Chuck: 6:10

So yeah, wow, wow, yeah, man. So so you growing up as a kid, how was it for you? Like, when you finally got out of the house, you thought you, you know, felt like you was grown and you know I would get older time to leave home. How was that for you?

Rufus Thornton: 6:26

Well, I was different than a lot of my friends. Um, I was poor but I was accepted because I had a lot of talents. Like I was the first one to actually put a tape inside and play the instrumental. I had another tape recorder so you can record my voice to the little instrumental and guys like oh and I freestyle rap. Like you know I can be, I can create anything in the class today.

Chuck: 6:47

You know what?

Rufus Thornton: 6:47

they say, and over there, but I'm having it my way. You know anything I can go off the spot, so they weren't doing it. But I guess, going through so many phases in life, to where you know I grew up, where you know the life, skin, generation, you know I've never been fortunate enough to meet you yet, brother, but you had to. Chico de Barge brothers, you know. And then we were, we were, we were looked over a lot. You know what I'm saying, me being a darker young brother, nighty headed, and you know I went through those phases but at the same time I learned, cause I had a lot of jealousy and animosity. And then when you leave from there and get out in the free world and transition, you hear things about the Willie Lynch theory and all this, how you separate the lights from the darks and the field from the in-house, and you never know you actually live in that until you actually give out, get out and live. That you know. So anyway, coming up in that town, I seen so many different phases of life that I didn't understand and how it related to me, to where I was lost in the sauce growing up. But I knew I had a lot of potential cause. I can relate to a lot of things. You know what I'm saying. Growing up experiencing so many things that made me kind of creative. So in my 10th grade year, when my dad being gone, my dad was at one point time he was forbidden to come back into our town. So I started being a hard head with a single mother. You know a young man who reads, so she says I'm sending with your dad. Well, what caused me to leave? We had a sheriff at the time, like I said I was very talented, so I got a lot of attention to where we had this white girls group and they named themselves Neatness 12. Now you should call me D12, cause I've been dancing since I was 12 years old. I'm on my big dance contest. That's the example I'm gonna use, you know. So they wanted to actually dance and they you know they always been effectuated by our dances and our athletes and everything.

Chuck: 8:30

So I said I'm gonna try it.

Rufus Thornton: 8:32

So in my town I had about 12 white girls and I was training, I was teaching them the new dances, and it got around to their parents and they told them no, we're not up there with that, with that N word and you can't do it. Well, my teacher in school her name, God bless the dead One of the most productive people we had and her name was Marie Ellis. She was one of the. She was like one of the civil rights leaders of our little town. She always gave us a way to express ourselves through talent shows and be creative, and that's very big for a child to not know his talents. And you get together and she tried to enhance that ability inside of you. Even though you dark, you got some things that are special about you. So when I can dance and compete, you know it made me feel like I was somebody that way. Anyway, one of the white girls that was on my crew was the sheriff's daughter, oh, wow. And we were all in high school at the time and, like I said, this was probably around ninth, 10th grade, but she had a young, young white boy During that time. Probably people would let their kids marry in the teens and stuff like that. Well, she married one and he heard rumors about Mimi being with this girl, which is all rumors, but at the same time, you know, in that society you can act on instinct, Right right, One particular group of people, and there was no consequence Sort of like it is today. But it was kind of bold back then and I was asked to come up to the sheriff's office. So my older brother took me to the sheriff's office and we get in there and ask him to sit outside, call me in there, and this little white boy and the sheriff come in. They stick a double barrel in my mouth and broke my front teeth. I got a gap. Now with a cracked tooth today it reminds me of double barrels. Yeah. So he told me. He said there's a rumor that he says it's true and I said no, sir, and I'm crying. So the young white gentleman, he's about a year or two younger than me and he's like yes, you are, and he's spitting in my face as he talked and I got a double barrel in my face. Finally they back off, probably after being in there it's probably was five minutes, but it seemed like five years and I was left for my brother, Like what's wrong? I was crying, let's go, let's go Right, and we go back and I tell my mom what it is and they call my dad and my dad was pretty upset about it but they know he was banned. So my mom's like you're going to stay with your dad? Wow. So I'm from a small town, it's like a one-eighth school, but I moved to a bigger school. My dad was doing contract work over there and that's when I got a chance to see different things For my abilities and right about the neighborhoods I grew up in and where I grew up, you know we didn't have blood Crips. We had First Street, Second Street, Dancer Street Got you, but at the same time, you know, we had Bainbridge and Duns a little small town.

Chuck: 10:56

So those are our games, right.

Rufus Thornton: 10:58

But yeah, it ain't no guns being on us who can knock the dirt out of my hand if the bad is one, and stuff like that back then you know. But now I moved to a town where you know, man, you know that little boy shot his brother. I'm like what, why they do that.

Chuck: 11:12

So going to that town.

Rufus Thornton: 11:13

Yeah, different experience. So I got there, man, and, like I said, I played basketball because my friends played basketball. I played football because my friends played football. It wasn't because I wanted to be the at that time, next Tony D'Arce or something like that, it was just because my friends played. But I got over there and one day I had a friend, one of the guys I met when I moved at it. I went there a summer before to stay with my dad. I met some guys, but this one super athlete God best of that His name was Marlo Marley.

Chuck: 11:38

OK.

Rufus Thornton: 11:39

And he was a super athlete quarterback. Now I'm in the 10th grade. Now, to back it up a little bit, they told me if I would have stayed and wouldn't have moved, the coach was not going to count my absences and he would have let me play football and basketball. But they said, if I leave, they were going to count my absences and I would have to repeat the 10th grade Got you. So I tell him my mom wanted to stay because I had most of my family there. But my mom like, nah, you're going. So when I left they counted my absences so I had to repeat the 10th grade, wow. So anyway, I go there and I meet with my friend that I met over where my dad moves to his Camden County, kingsland, georgia, wonderful county, and he takes me to football practice with him. I'm not on the team, I just moved down the new guy. But they got these tri-step pause. One is two feet high, one is probably three and a half, one is probably four, four and a half feet. So while they're on the football field, I'm over there vertically jumping on top of them, because I'm bored, I ain't got nothing to do, I don't know it. So I see the football team stopping, they're looking at me and I'm like, oh, I'm probably somewhere I'm not supposed to be. But I'm like I'm going to turn my back to them, I'm going to keep jumping on them. So I'm jumping on the one, like I think four, four and a half feet, but I'm doing this as a vertical, and they start walking towards me. So this coach, coach Tom, was telling me hey, he called his other coach hey, do that again. And I was like what? And he was like jump on that box. So I vertically jumped on the team. They go wow, and at this time this was a 3A school, so it's three times as many people as them used to the athletes are two, three times as bigger, Bigger, bigger. Yeah, I'm like I'm like I know I ain't really doing them, cause I'm in this, I'm like in Vegas or something like. Then it was like the Vegas, but he told me man, this is amazing, you're an amazing kid. You got a medical bill and I'm like what?

Chuck: 13:12

So we had me run, and how were you?

Rufus Thornton: 13:14

I probably at that time maybe I was 17. Yeah, I feel, yeah, I was 17 at that time. Wow, my birthday's in September. So when he told me, I never heard that you know, so I never heard that. So during football season they played and then we went to the basketball. We were playing basketball in the gym and it's this black coach. I never really had a black coach and I schooled. They picked somebody who probably is a veterinarian to be the coach and he can't spell football, the basketball but that's what they made the coach, right, but you know that's what they do, but anyway. So I was playing basketball and everybody on the team dunking. Now back home we had two guys, charles Rig and Chris. They were like six, four, six, three, six, four. For a small school, those are the great black hopes and they used to dunk and pawn the ball and when we dunk we had to go. That's probably eight foot high and we do the microjord. So now, moving to this big town, they got regular 10 foot goals but we got guys that are my side dunking and I'm like, wow. So what happened was I'm practicing ball with them and I jump and I'm dunking and they going behind the back and this is all type of new stuff that I'm seeing. They very creative because, they from a place that allows you to do these things. We're from a place where, if you don't, and celebrate the coach, hey, that's, that's not how we do things and we stopped because we'll be taken to this school. They dunk and hanging out the room talking about your mama. Right, right, yeah. So so I'm, I'm, I'm like, wow, more freely to do these things that I wasn't and I learned to dunk, and this coach told me fundamentals of basketball. I was never taught fundamental. I can run and jump. I was used to that because we run in the woods, we farm boys, so we always acted. But anyway I was noticed then and girls starting to like me. I remember in the hall one day they was like this girl. She was a cheerleader and she said that's a cute black boy right there and I look around because I'm one like black people are cute, like what black I want to be like him. Yeah, you know, not like that. You know how they put emphasis oh, that's a cute light and this is a cheerleader. You know, when I hear like look at Rufus and you know he can dance, that's what I hear. When it's something, you know, a compliment to me. But so I turn around. And when I turn around, literally looking behind me, like who's this cute black boy? I want to know, does he have an S girl in his head or something? What's up? So she taps me on the shoulder and said what's your name? And I was like I said me and you know it went. From now I was like wow, so I learned more about who I was and didn't know because how much you know I'm in an environment where people compliment you know what I'm saying blackness, because they was. It's not different to them. They don't have, you know. So, moving to that town, camden County is like my second home Now. The first town is right north of Tallahassee, over in the Southwest corner, and this county just so happened to be right above Jacksonville, on the Southeast corner, both by the water and caucus, right by those that in Florida is on the corner. So going there, you know I learned a lot. You know I began to be fast because the women were a lot more fast than I was, like in the country. Oh man, you got to catch them on the fall armor Sometimes when they mama in church and they late for church or something like that. But over that issue they catching you and I'm like I ain't used to this, I'm trying to keep up. So it caused me to live a lifestyle that I wasn't accustomed to. That wasn't healthy for me because you know everybody glorified, you know we got a bunch of women and he's a great basketball player, so I'm just trying to fit in with. Really, I grew up in a like a church going. Yeah, my mom didn't have that and my dad wouldn't either. But he's a rolling stone so you know he ain't gonna say go out and mess with a girl. If you do, he'll smile. That's my boy. He was here to do it, so now I'm over that with him. So that didn't help much. I've been with mom. She said you've done I have no girls in this house. So over there it kind of pushed, pushed me in a situation to where you had guys that were involved in dope. You got, you know, same thing you don't have a lot of blood and Chris but you got more of the gang affiliated because we're right above Jacksonville Florida, jacksonville Florida. You got them Turner. You know what I'm saying. You got to do all that time back then. You got to do that club, mr P's, and now you forget I'm in the music and dancing. So when they see me, dance now my dad. I have cousins that used to come down and I was, like I said, I've been talented most of my life. So when they have a dance competition in this big town, oh, it's lights out. People didn't even want to dance against me. I'm like y'all can't do that. Like I can do the Michael Jackson, I break out and I'm I do the MC Hammer. Right, so I could just, I could do a variety of dancing. So if you just used to doing the running man, you dead and stinking. I'm like, no, I'm doodling, grind bro, I'm doing the whoop there, it is all that. So you know. So I got a lot of attention, but at the same time, what I like about it is some of the things I didn't feel comfortable doing because of the things that my mom and still decided me from the little small town, even though I'm surrounded by a lot of stuff that I was doing, but I didn't have that dog in me that most of them had to get comfortable. You know, pushing a cat down off the box, if we were in town we could. That's the guy I'm gonna sleep with tonight. That's my homeboy. That's my cousin. You know I ain't finna file him that hard. I'm gonna be nice to him. But these guys, the same guy tellin' my cousin Marlo, he bowed me in the chairs, I fell down. Then he stepped down there on my head and went up there and tried to clap it off the glass and look back at him. I'm like man, I thought we were friends and he told me to get up, you know. But I had to adjust to that. So the lifestyle with the multiple women, all that I adjusted to, but I'd never felt comfortable with it. But when society is telling you you're no longer a dark, nappy-headed boy, you're cool now because you're messing with girls, that you're tired for a kid to turn that down. So anyway, bro, I started playing sports over there but I couldn't play in my 12th grade a year because, remember, back home they made me stay in the 10th grade and got prop 48. You only eligible for four years of basketball sports period. So, being a super duper senior because I failed 10th grade, I wasn't able to play and I felt embarrassed because I started feeling myself. They were like man, that dude can shoot, he's bad, he can dance, he's real talented. But the people that I bragged to was like I told y'all he wasn't gonna be nothing. And it took me back to what I used to feel in my old time, back in the 80s, like I'm not worthy of something. So people were trying to tell me about man, go to college. Man, you move to college, prop 48, hit the bench. And I'm like, nah, man, I ain't wanna do that. Because people are telling me in my surroundings that you ain't gonna start, oh boy, no guys, I don't hear doubting you. I hit 20 points on these guys. They get scholarships and everything but they get to go play. So I ended up going to the army, bro. And when I went to the army, first thing I did in basic training they say, hey, it's the end of the basic training, I go over there I'm dancing same talents, everybody know my wild two knock I was. Nah, I got a little bit of that dog at me being around Jacksonville and Gannon. So the drill sergeant say drop and give me a twin. I said that's all you want. You don't want no change. You talking trash. Yeah, I'm talking trash in basic. So guys look at me like who this cat? But the ladies love it. Like the ladies like, oh, he's confident. Right, right, right I meet this girl from Connecticut man and you know education wasn't a thing in my family, like to go to college and do that. But I meet this tall girl and I was at E1 when I came in and I was like she a PFC, like how you do that in UN Basic? And she's like oh, I go to Yukon. She went to Yukon with Jennifer Rosati and Rebecca Lobo. Then she was tall and she speak enough the eight in words. I'm a country boy.

Chuck: 20:21

I'm saying Problem for you yeah, yeah, I'm like man. What was in the go?

Rufus Thornton: 20:25

Yeah, that's it. But she likes that and I'm like she ain't gonna talk to me cause you know she wants some, you know professor or something. I'm not that guy, so I'm just being myself. But at that point in time now I'm dealing with people from California, new York, oregon, yeah, all around Mexican Spanish right and they respected me for a different reason. They call what people is like you talk too much in the South, shut up. When you come off, the rim dunk and be quiet. They tell you man, that's good You're confident yeah. Right. But these new people in the military tell me that's confidence. You just have to back up what you bragging about. You know what I'm saying. So now I'm like, oh, so I could have been this guy and I didn't have to have a bunch of women or I didn't have to be black and bald headed. I just had to be me and back up what I'm talking about and people will respect you. So the military teaching me something else about myself now. So now it's layers, it's layers, right, right. So this girl, she ended up looking at me and I'm like, hey, why are you looking at me? Why are you talking to me? I'm just looking. She says, what are you doing? And we start talking. I'm like, and I'm country, I don't know, I don't know what they call it Chivalry coming in all smooth. I seen Billy D on, but I ain't got no curls.

Chuck: 21:37

You're going way back now. You're going to be.

Rufus Thornton: 21:40

Yeah, I come straight out. You like me, and that's it. I ain't got no forward play. I'm like hey, you like me?

Chuck: 21:45

Right.

Rufus Thornton: 21:46

And they were like what I said, you like me, you know. She's like where are you from?

Chuck: 21:50

Right right.

Rufus Thornton: 21:50

I was on some car with and she said you some car with. Yeah. So she said you're a country bumping. I ain't never heard of a country. I guess cause in the country we don't say country bumping.

Chuck: 21:59

But everybody's like you should be yourself.

Rufus Thornton: 22:01

Yeah, but she's from Connecticut. I said what's a country bumping? She said you. And she said but you're cute though I love it. I said you say that like I'm an animal or something. So, anyway, the conversation, I'm learning that, being me, and respectfully, yeah, you know, I can get in places that I didn't think I could be. Right, I can meet people that I thought was before and beyond me by being myself, knowing myself and being proud of myself and not letting the things that I've been through in the country and in Jacksonville caused me to limit myself by being stuck on that. That's how I had to go through processes of life, yeah and all to be able to get into these new areas of life. That's powerful. So anyway she was. We became close friends, man, we were still friends. Today We've been over 30 some years. That's the longest friend I ever had. That wasn't from Coke with Georgia.

Chuck: 22:46

Coke when I grew up from. Yeah.

Rufus Thornton: 22:48

So anyway, man, when I went into the military man from basic, they had a basketball team and I played and now I got some skills because I got confidence and everything. So we won a little tournament there and then went to Fort Lee, virginia, my first time going to Virginia, and that's where you learned actually your job training. I was supplied there, logistics and going into that area, man, I get there. I hear people say there you go. And they say that's them. They said, they said, they said GA. And that's the first time I really heard GA and I was like GA.

Chuck: 23:21

What is that? Like yeah, georgia OK, georgia OK. They say you.

Rufus Thornton: 23:24

GA, ain't you? They said man. You who? They said man, come on, we're going to the gym, I'm such a 430. And I was like man where I'm from, you know, kamlin kind of taught me strangers because I know people who kill you that you don't know Cogwood, I can be out with anybody. So it used to be good. I remember that. You know what I remember. Like I told you about cousins, it doesn't matter who you were, I can go to 50 different houses and eat where I'm from and not going to do how you do them as lowest, how you do them as Gloria. You know how you're doing, man, and there's a roof that's coming in. Get you a plate, come on, get you something.

Chuck: 23:51

Come on in now. Yeah, but when I went, to Camden it was like hey man, you got to be careful you can't go over there and go to Jacksonville you can't go out there, you can't go on Duvall and Jacksonville, man, you can't do that.

Rufus Thornton: 24:01

I'm like, oh man, I'm just just why. Why we can't go? That lady cooking over there in barbecue and I should be able to get me a plate, it ain't like that. So now I go to the Army and different people from different places making me feel like I'm back in my little country town, everybody with everybody, and they respect me. I'm the light skinned guy now you know what I'm saying, but I'm still not light skinned. Everybody favoring me because it ain't because I'm right. So now when I go to AIT in basic now I'm going to a place I never been before and people know me. This is a third level of Identity, who you know that they have. So these guys say you ain't you GA? I'm like yeah, I'm like what's up? I thought realize he was talking about George. He's like man, we hoop in the day at 430. Man, you need to be there. And I'm like I said I know you and he was like no. He said no, my boy came now. Then y'all come from the only Missouri. And I was like yeah, he's a. No, we just came from Fort Jackson. He's a. My boy told me about. He said listen, I got you. He said just come around to the gym. And I'm like wow, like really, like who am I to get this type? Wow yeah, we hope. So we go in a meeting guys. No, we hoping I'm wrong with it. I'm like, damn damn. He's like yeah, man, I like you, so I build a friendship there with people from different places and Now and basically you don't have a chance to really know anybody like what they found out. Everything is like Go shoot a m16, go learn how to do the band there, go fight Eat in two minutes and get up. So you don't really have a chance to really get to know nobody like that. You got it. When you go, when it's time to get in, you go to sleep, wake up and you running and marching again. So, but in a IT, got a lot of downtime because just learning your particular job, basic is a place where everybody, regardless of who you are, you're gonna learn how to shoot a weapon. If you a medic, plurical, whatever, so when you go to basic, right, then that's what the military, back to the military teaches you. You know I'm saying you government issues. So that's about the military first and I like that concept because I think everybody should know the basics of life Because as I, as we go throughout my testimony, I'm sharing with you, my brother, my most success in the military, from all these foreign places, came from what I learned in a small town in Corkwood, georgia the basics of life. Basically, everybody got along. You feed your brother. If I did something old-aided, 50 blocks out the road can see it and I'll be scared. I'm scared. Yeah, the police can tell you we ain't finna rush, I'm finna take you to your mom. He's like no, take me to jail, please don't Right. Right, you know I'm saying so I'm from a place like that. So to come to another place and start to see some of these same behaviors from people that I've never met before. It gives me a different level of understanding and life that you know, like where I'm from. I know that my mom taught me boy you respect and say yes, ma'am, no, ma'am, you mind your business. Go over there and do what children do, the same thing we talked about earlier. I know if I go into this gym I stay in my lane right. If a brother is mad and get out of this lane, we stay out. This way I respect that. I give me space and learning these small-town things where I thought I was uneducated and black and one worse Nothing. I learned how to adjust in these areas. That's far, far away from Corkwood, georgia, yeah. So people asked me what my greatest success is. I said the smallest things in the smallest places in life. My greatest thing? Simplistic, yeah, yeah, right, exactly, bro, yeah, so anyway, I was at a it, bro. We stayed out eight weeks and my first duty station was German. When I go to Germany I actually get in Germany and it's a flip-flop. Actually, german people, particularly the females, love darker men and Me going there. You know, coming from where I come from. Now I learned a little bit more about the clan and stuff like this. Things I have seen when I was in the military. I've seen a lot of. I seen a lot of it in our military. I had got the concept in that all clan members is bad, even though I knew my mom worked at this time. She wasn't retired at this time because I just got a military. So I'm like, oh, I was. That man could have killed me, I could have hung. He was trying to set my mom up, so I call my mom on you. All right, you still work with such a searcher. She's like, yeah, baby, what you worry about, yeah, the other yada, yada, and I'll be trying to. You know, I was worried because of my lack of understanding, right, but then you know this was prior to him, happy, my mama retired. So, brother, over there in Germany, when I hit Germany, they, they got this thing called orientation where you learn the few German words like the righty-os link school right or left. If you heist, do how are you doing good and talk good off and good morning. So I started learning the language over there and I was like man, it's fun because I, you know, when I was in school, bro, well, they said you go to Spanish class because I didn't care about being on no Dean's list or none of that man, I wanted to go to class. If I can go to lunch, all six periods, that's where I'm going. My partners if it was six of us in a class, and that's especially a class my partners in, I want to go to that class. I'm a fight to go in there. I don't care nothing about taking no advanced classes. You know, I'm saying it's about being around my partners and my people and have fun. But now you know, messing with the girl from Connecticut. She was like, oh, you never heard of such a search and you never heard of. And I'm like Constantine, um, but Psychiatrist, and I'm like why you want to know that? Like they ain't from Georgia, like they're from Connecticut. But she tells me the purpose of it and she's giving me this because I like her and she respected me first as a little naughty it dude. So when you reach someone like that and you respect someone, you can have them interested in stuff that they don't know. And when I heard the movie, like you got to reach them for your teacher, I didn't understand. I heard that before I met this girl. You got to reach one for your teacher. Well, I was hearing people say that my cousin come from New York. I ain't it just sound cool? And they got the accent. So I was like you got to reach one for your teacher. I don't know what it means. So now you know I'm saying meeting her. I was like, oh, so that's what it is. Stacey respected me, she showed me some stuff and y'all. Yeah, I hate to say her name, but anyway, I'm married my wife. She gonna be that by my wife understand who I am. I got nine children and six baby mums and my wife is One of the Christian girls and I wouldn't have took me If I was in my wife's shoes. But I'm gonna have to share that testimony, yeah hold up, you say yeah, how many babies. I got nine babies and six baby mums. I had nine children from the age of 23 to 33. I had nine children. Yeah, you know, what I'm sharing with you is gonna come together. You know, thought I wasn't nothing in there. Women's society, I'll make you think you're doing the right thing. And popularity. And you got to understand. I thought we're 23 to have a kid before 23 if it didn't have a jukebox on my head with batteries in it or a Carburet box so I can break dance. I don't care nothing about you and your sex. You know I'm saying but let me, let me, let me not jump, let me kind of get to that part. So in Germany I learned the language and we played basketball in Germany. Who was doing athletics in Germany? And I was going to the club and we were dancing. So I'm kind of popular in Germany, but it's about the professionalism of life I never learned. I never learned like, hey, you got to look the part and you know, I always grew up as a country boy, you know guys from upstate. You said, man, y'all increases in y'all pants, man, like what's that for? But I was raised like that, yeah, on some cowboy boots and some tight jeans and a and a nice shirt. Yeah, oh, man, the women go. Oh, he looked good. But then out there, my New York partners in DC partners. They were like man, what are you doing? Man? But I've grown to this point to know be you roofless, just be respectfully you. They gonna accept it. Just represent who you are, way at you. So when I wore my crease in my pants and I went out, not only did it separate me from a lot of people, mm-hmm, they had a perception of country people. That totally gave them a different look when they met me. Yeah, they like man, this country do, hoping, like this country do, dancing on the dance. So not only is he doing the two-step country slide, but this cat doing the hammer, the cha cha cha. I'm doing New York, I'm doing California, I'm housing, I'm with my partner in DC. He teach me a man, we do go, go go, go Right right. So when he was doing go go and I was like I danced off doing the butt before but I ain't really no, no, go go DJs like he gave me a more of an insight on what go go really, was it got?

Chuck: 31:45

different.

Rufus Thornton: 31:45

DJs. Only when I knew that you know they're doing the butt down and everybody associated that where I'm from with DC. But he's like no man. He's that's all you never heard of yaya yaya and I like no. So when he showed me that and I learned, I became cool with DC. I became cool with Virginia. I became cool in New York now. So it's a different type than just being military cool and our job nice. Hey, dude, when I go and leave, I'm gonna take you to New York. Now I got cousins from New York right when I go on leave and leave Germany and we go to DC. I'm in DC and I'm meeting these people and everybody think and that's country boy, so you gonna speak to you 50 times that they don't worry about that. They just I do he good people though, and I'm like 50,000 day ain't nothing. Where I'm from, we supposed to speak a hundred times. Today we got that love and I say that in the crowd and they be like he's so funny and I'm like, damn, it feels good To get this type of attention and it's love. Yeah, that's real love. So everybody was like everywhere he go, you don't meet a stranger and I never heard that before. I heard it in Germany. When I got back with my partner Right me everywhere, I took him man, he ain't meet no stranger night I like. What does that mean? So you got to understand. I'm learning a lot of this stuff because it's phases in my life right. So the older sergeants, when I start meeting some of the guys that were involved in like black marketing in Germany, like they got what they call a ration card to give all soldiers. That mean you can buy up to, I think, a certain amount of liquor every month and it replenishes. It starts over like roll over minutes. You know how they just starts over a certain amount of. Well, you can go on post right down the military base and buy down on the gym, probably for nine dollars, but you can go right off post in Germany and sell it for 90 bucks. So me I'm thinking it's innocent because I'm like whoa, you know, because I see the New York cats doing it DC, but they hustlers there. But that's a different type of hustler that I was when I was accustomed to in Georgia and Florida. They move fast like I'm like wow, I'm trying to keep up. So with me being so bold, like they, they know how to sit back and be quiet. I don't, I'm just lying to it. Like yeah, I was like you know I got, yeah, I'm all I. I'm like why this dude got $100, you know so anyway, and you know I grew up in, like I said, I grew up in a time in the 70s, drugs Billers where the brotherhood you can be openly selling the drugs a little bit more. You know I'm saying because that's what I remember the drug dealers doing. So I know we kind of doing wrong, but when I grew up you can kind of do it more open. They're like no man, you want no military people to see. Yes, so they were teaching me a conniving way of doing it. I go to making a lot of money, got you. So now I got popularity and I got money and the German women like me oh my god, it's over. I'm like man, I'm trying to man, I'm trying to write. I'm the man again, I don't differ. Now we're like. I'm like I ain't never been this before, like when I literally go to some German town this is African, like my brother, what's up? My brother and I'm like oh man, I'm Turkish people and I'm dancing, I'm learning the cha-cha from from Italy and France, and then I'm playing basketball over there and we traveling.

Chuck: 34:45

Right.

Rufus Thornton: 34:45

So I'm being exposed to so much I can't even soak it in. So you know what I said. Man, I start doing things in a Sergeant, Sergeant Sanders. He's on my social media page and. Curtis, george, these are older brothers that pull me to the side like throwing. I love you, man and boy, you, you, why you remind me of myself. But we want to pull your side because you got potential. And I was like, yeah, this man. And so you got courage. Things that I heard and basic, like that Stacy told me like hey, you, you confident, you got courage, like you know this stuff. And they said you smart. I didn't really hear I was smart until Stacy told me Stacy went to you, come out, and I thought she was just trying to flirt with me. Like you know, you tell a girl you like her, but you really don't, you just trying to get what you want. So when Stacy used to tell me I was smart, brother, being a Yukon student that you come back in, she used to tell me why. She said you helped me with my homework. I was like it was simple to me, like she'll have history and I won't know the particulars of that in history to tell you who was in charge or whatever I said, but what they fight for, I was like, well, why would they do that if it was slavery and we all supposed to be considered the US? Why would they say hey, if you come up here and you're free. I said to me you ain't free, because any other time, if you know, it's like this if my mama say whatever, go in my brother room, and she got to make her bed, my sister got to make his bed, mama. I'm going to check both of them and make sure everything's in order. So it's some division still there. And she was like oh, I never looked at like that and I'd be like she said you're so smart, that's what this was, so it's all and I'll be like what? You know what I'm saying, but I'm a country boy, but that I just gave my simple things in life.

Chuck: 36:11

You look at it like that.

Rufus Thornton: 36:12

So when my sergeant was like man, you smart. I said man, the guy, to have some truth to it, because the girl that I met and how I met her, you should tell me that. So I'm kind of listening to him. I stopped doing a lot of things with my New York and brothers. But when you want to change and you want something that's worth, something right, a lot of the outside influences will see you as popular as you were and it depends on how attached you are to that. It's going to complicate change more Got you when you're in the process of becoming the soldier that they say you can be, because you're not going to be viewed from the outside as you're going through the process. Now, when you become the product of that process, you find that same glorification. But as you're going through the process of it, you might get broke here. Light, soft, you ain't got a clean uniform, you might smell a little different because you're trying to hustle so hard to gather everything or you ain't got time to do so. So you work and then you forget some of the basics and you got a base man. Hey, man like OK, but I just got in at three o'clock and we had the information at six o'clock so I just jumped in the bed and chain closed and got up. But it showed up the first time. You sweat Everything you forgot to do.

Chuck: 37:20

Everybody from LA.

Rufus Thornton: 37:22

Right. So you go through embarrassment there. You go through to seeing who your true homies are, because when they talk about you. They be like man, that Georgia boy, man I know you can shoot, but y'all need to shoot them some soap and water or something like that. And I'm made of base. I'm like. I'm like boy, you ain't base. You're coming at night that's still dry, whooping you with a switch. Get in there and baby, we got to go to school at six o'clock. I'm gonna come in from working for that guy Sometimes 11, 12 at night. She'll check that shower, check our rags or see what we just got in the bed. Nosh got that outside Slip whooper. So I grew up you had to have good hygiene. But I'm going through a phase now to where I'm losing a lot of the popularity that I got accustomed to in Europe because somebody that was a higher ranking and had a true concern for me wanted me to reach my fullest potential. Pull you to the side, right. So me myself, it was easier for me to kind of leave it because the things that they say it reminded me of some things that my mom said man, you got to respect, you know, the chain of command, not respect upon the Chico, or why the hundreds from New York, you got to expect the chain of command. And when I, when I say, ok, respect the chain of command, they say, yeah, this is man. Listen, it's all this. You already look good, they said, man, you always on your uniform. They complimented when everybody else was saying, hey, the guy had to such and such, he needed to. You know, look, a certain way he might need to hit that soap and water man. He came to be forgetting that man. Whatever the case may be, they were like boy, you smell what limit is? And you went hard last night. Then you said man, after this formation, what you have to do is take your food to the room which you can't sit in, the child. And you got to take it to the room which you got to go ahead and eat it in the room while you get to shower, you try and eat in the and you ain't got enough time, you'll be tired, so you can't, you know. So they teaching me how to make it through this transitional period, versus a lot of people telling me like, oh, you got to bathe, you ain't telling me how I can bathe, bro, I ain't got 30 minutes to go to formation, eat and bathe, I can't and be back out here so you can tell me what I got to do, but I need somebody to show me Got you so that's an important part, what I just shared with you, because I learned that from my sergeants. So anyway, when we went to doing it, they didn't tell me to stop being who I was. They said, man, we like that and like if we out in the field and they be like man, it's a club guy. Now they said, oh, I'm going with private thorn, I'm going with specialist thorn, and I was like they were like y'all going out, so they be like, yeah, but they taking me and I was like why y'all taking me? This is called you while thorn. So they tell me to stop being who I was, just to modify and adjust how I was doing it. You get what I'm saying. So I started to get a new respect as I went through and then I started getting rank. But the guys that was glorifying me for the black marketing and going to different places, I started to outrank them. Then it changed a little bit motor where they were like oh man, you know, now you're a sergeant, you act funny and where I'm from, I'm a caring person because I'm from a small town, but because you don't have that dog like that, yeah, but it's like. It's like oh, it's like that now, like bro, you got to be in formation. Like I tell people like in business I say you got to have a dog in business and they be like what's your name? I say cause this is a lot of lying tigers and balsam that are going to eat you up If you don't know how. And I was like you got to tell somebody to do simple things like be on time. And they want to stay stuck in their ways and they won't. But when they late they look at it as if it ain't that bad thing and you might say it ain't that bad of thing until the higher echelon that you know how important it is for everybody to be here, because the task can't be fulfilled unless you got this requirement and need to be met. And they got a systematic design to tell you how many men need to do it, how much time. So I went through that and I got in trouble trying to appease both sides. I was trying to be nice to my street partners but trying to live by the code of the military and I couldn't do both, couldn't balance it out. Well, I made a choice briefly to kind of start appeasing my friends, because I got 5% of talking to me now and they shooting the thing like man. You know we here, but you know this army was created for the black man and you supplied the centers. Really you should? You shouldn't really value your position because you realize, when it created the army, the only thing they would let us do is serve people and that's why you supply. They said tell me who you got. That's what. We got Cooks yeah, service. And I was like yo, we got medical yeah, service. And so I'm like, yes, I'm starting to view the military like old slaves. That's what they did to my mama. They wouldn't let my mama, my mama, going through this phase. What she's trying to say, this is the same thing. So I ain't respecting the military because I'm listening to these brothers and it's a lot of truth and bad, like it's a lot of truth and good, if that makes sense to you. Yeah, because what they say, it wasn't a lot. But I can give you these grits. I can get to you straight out the pot and it's going to burn your mouth. Or I can get the grits out the pot and I can blow it and cool it off for you and then give it to you. You're going to receive the same thing. They were giving it to me, yeah they were giving it to me straight out the pot. Yeah and yeah, and it was just burning me up and I'm reacting to it. So I started back away and started to piece a lot of other things other than the military and I didn't lose nothing because of the respect that they had for me. But I didn't gain that that. I didn't move up. So once I got in trouble, there was some law involved and black market in and became the best oppose and I got in trouble and because of what they've seen in me, they didn't punish me like they punished everybody. So it opened my eyes to go ahead and focus on what I need to focus on. It was a learning experience and when I did that I learned you know what I'm saying from that incident that my mom is telling me boy respect goes a long way.

Chuck: 42:37

So is this the time where you say you know you got in trouble and went to prison?

Rufus Thornton: 42:42

No, no, no, no, no, no. Oh, this is preparing me for the testimony. I'm going to tell you yes. So when I left, I stayed in Germany. When I left Germany, it took me to Fort Hood, texas. So I went to Fort Hood Texas. Now I've been in Germany you go in Germany three years. I graduated when I was 19. So right now I'm about 22. So when I go to Texas, texas is one of the biggest military posts other than Fort Bragg, north Carolina.

Chuck: 43:03

Right my favorite.

Rufus Thornton: 43:04

So I'm at Fort Hood and I got some homeboys that I grew up with in a small town. They've been good brothers so I started hanging out with them when we started meeting each other and started living in lines. Well, I see this girl. She's a medic. And now I'm still talking to Stacy up in Connecticut.

Chuck: 43:16

Right.

Rufus Thornton: 43:17

So we still have been friends. I've been in Germany two years, so we still friends. She's still. We're talking when I come back to the States that we're supposed to hook up where at that time she got studied. She's like babe, we're doing finals and we're doing this. I can't comment, I ain't used to that. You know, I'm from a small town to where you say you miss me. I'm just going to throw a rock on your farm doing you, going to peep out the window and I get to see you know. So yeah, I need it right now. I've been spoiled. You know women just I don't have to wait. My name is Ruth, was thorn, what you mean. I don't have to wait, but I respect her, but I ain't used to waiting. So I'm down there and I meet this young lady from South Carolina and I see her walking and I'm going to the game. I've been playing basketball and I've been there like a year and I see her walking. I pull up and I was like hey, lady, I was like what you doing? And you know she was like keep walking. I was like hey, ma'am, what you doing. I said I want to invite you out to the game. So I remember I told you before, when I first met Stacy, I like you, like me. So I was just straight blunt.

Chuck: 44:10

But now, you know, I've been around these. Dc cats and New.

Rufus Thornton: 44:13

York man, I don't know, let's give me two minutes, you out of there. So I was like, no, I'm just trying to invite you to the game. What you found yourself in South Carolina, I could tell you from the crib, georgia. And I said let me just take you to the game. If you don't like it I'll take you out to eat, but if you do like it I'm gonna take you out to eat. So she laughs. She said okay. So we went on, went to the game. Oh, I had an awesome game. So we started talking and when we started talking I was at the end. They was trying to send me to a promotion course that was um, that give me Sergeant stripes. It was called PLDC. So you got to go through that process and this lady was like you know, you want to go to this course? How long you been in? And at that time I've been in Germany two years and basics. So I said I only been in like two and a half years. I said I want to, you know whatever? And she was like and you're already a specialist. I said, yeah, I probably could have been promoted. But I kind of got into a little trouble when you're and she was telling me things like I'm proud of you. And she was like, yeah, I went to South Carolina State, I went to college. And no, I was like shoot, I remember I always wanted to go to college but I was embarrassed because people like I told you he wasn't going to play start, so I ain't go to college, but I always wanted to. So something about her telling me she been to college was like man, that's all. Tell me about it, tell me how it is. Yada, yada, yada. So, when she was telling me about her experience in college. It caused me to connect with her in a way to where she saw that I had the potential of being in and it made it kind of fulfilled something in my life that I wanted. And she was telling me like you should have went. She said they ain't tell you about property. I said, yeah, they mentioned it to me but I didn't really understand. And she started telling me and I started seeing like man, I missed a lot of opportunities not knowing and I could have done that and just waited a year and just practice it. And she was telling me things that made me feel like she had been there with me and she can connect. And she understood for a long time she got pregnant. I had known her probably about about four months off top that country, so okay, that's a man. She said I'm pregnant and I said let's get married. And I had known about four months. You like what I said I want to marry you and she said why? She said tell me why you want to marry me. Now. That's the moment. Like I said, I've been to New York with these cat, dc and these cat. We were running pretty good. Well, I'm sitting back watching them, seeing my girls react to them from different parts. I can relate to the Puerto Rican day parade. I haven't been to the taste in Chicago so I might can't tell you about all the scientists, but I can lay some topics down that'll let you know. Kind of versatile. So now I'm going to talk about the things that I'm going to talk about. So now I'm feeling myself and I'm able to have a conversation with a college girl, to where I can actually keep her intrigued with my conversation. So she asked me why I like and I said can I tell you why I don't like you first I'll save time or whatever. I said because I've learned that beauty is only skin deep. I said beauty is more than just skin deep. Yada, yada, yada. I'm a country boy. So I gave her this analogy. She never forget. I said you know, it ain't the break in the land that's in it important part. I said, but it's part of the process. And I said when I plan to see it ain't just me putting the seed in the ground, so what I continue to do while the seed is in the ground. I said you've been with him, me, throughout this whole process. You've seen me act crazy. You've seen me have to break down things so I can, you know, be more appealing to you. Yada, yada, yada. And now you've put something inside of me to where I think I got to stay connected with you for life in order for that to grow. So it's no other way but marrying me. You stuck with me and so that part, you know, she's just filed and I'm like, man, I must have won, I must have did it. And she went to the courthouse. We got married, just like that. My folks told me no, don't do it. Unlit, god bless the dead. She was like trade, you ain't ready. And I'm like I ain't ready, I'm like what you mean? I ain't ready, like.

Chuck: 47:34

I don't know what marriage is.

Rufus Thornton: 47:35

But I just knew she said why you want to be married and I said because she's pregnant with my baby. And I know what my mom went through and my dad and my mom always tell he died, had a respect for each other but he was just away. But she had to do a lot on her own and I know what happened to me because there was some childhood sexual abuse situations that you know for my parents sake like I could talk about it when a mom is a single mom and you trust society or leave your children in places that society respectfully men of society as church guys or deacons and they be the biggest pedophile Got you. So I've been a victim of that situation. So one of the reasons why I really want to marry my wife is because I want to be there and I wouldn't want my kid at the time, who was unborn, to go through that. So I married her and it probably lasted maybe, bro, maybe six months and we got a divorce and I went to Korea, went to Korea, met another chick, had a baby over that, had two for my wife. She had a baby over there. Now, if I'm 23, that's why I say I was going through some because it hurt me that I couldn't be with my wife. I felt like a failure because I feel like an I can always things like I'm driven to always accompany. If you started my, my mom like you got to finish that you can't just wash the dishes and leave to plate. So my mom said everybody eat, so Rufus can wash the dishes. So you got to finish this. It come from the small town teachings of finish what you started.

Chuck: 49:00

Right.

Rufus Thornton: 49:01

Right. So I felt like crap and I felt embarrassed like I did at high school when I couldn't accomplish college. So I said, hey, I want to go to Korea. So I went to Korea and I was a now, like I said, to see my mom and planted them and know I didn't want to mess with multiple women and I only had two children. But when I went there I met this girl from Texas, got you, we started knowing each other and I had my baby wife. I still got two young babies right now. I got a 28 year old, 27 year old and 26 year old first three girls and when she got pregnant I tried to marry her. I went back to to Texas so we couldn't be together and she's like be patient, I'm gonna try to get over that but, like I said, I'm not good with patience at that time, you know, I feel like I gotta have what I want. Now you gotta accomplish it, whatever the case may be. So, she couldn't get over that cause the military said, hey, he's not divorced yet, so we can't give y'all a compassionate reassignment, so you gotta do what they do. So when I went to Georgia I met another young lady that came from Korea and we was able to talk and she kind of knew me, Started kind of from Korea. I knew some people, I knew, I knew some people, she knew and started talking, yeah, and I got in a relationship with her. First we had three children. We had our first son. We wasn't serious and I was going back home to see my mom and I was coming back to see her. I was messing around with girls back home. I was coming back to Augusta, which is Fort going Georgia. But the difference while I'm messing with girls back home, because when I was home I was ruthless, the ball hit, dark skin got. It didn't really get a lot of attention. But now when I go back home, I've never seen some of the girls when I was young like it's pretty, but she would never talk to me. Now these same girls like oh, who's home? Y'all saying I'm like what Right? So now I'm responding to that and I'm because I like them. now, because I remember back in the day, I would love to talk to you but, and so next thing, you know, one of the girls got pregnant and I didn't know it. So when I went back up there I find out that, hey, you know this girl want to get serious. I said Okay, so I stopped going home and start focusing more on the girl that was in Augusta. No, I took her home. I said I'm gonna take you home and meet my mom. So I took her home to meet my mom. I said Mom, this is Sophia at the time and my mom's like Okay. I was like, well, we got your grandson and I see this other little boy in there right and she was like I was like Mom, who baby that is? She said yours, why? I said huh, she said a little girl down there that she was talking to. Yeah, she said I've been keeping this baby and they're one. My son was born January 29th and her own was born March 5th of March. So I'm like what, mom? And she was like yeah, and so after that, a year afterwards, we went back and I was like All right then. So we was going through that and went back. And when we got back a few months later the girl those days in the military she found that she was pregnant again. She's pregnant with my daughter. So then I feel like you know, I'm hearing people say he got all them chilling. That ain't good and to me that's a bad thing because it's still some of the things my mom taught me about image and I know my dad, even though he wasn't with my mom, he always been there Like a kid in Texas, there from South Carolina, the girl that I'm with she's really from New York and I, back home and caught with Georgia, I got a son and I'm like man, you know. So I try to satisfy everybody, but it's difficult, being in the military and I'm like man, so I just it's easier for me now to be what people are saying I am. So then I just start messing with people, whatever, and I ended up going home and getting another girl pregnant. And when I did that, this girl that I was dating in Augusta she kind of rolled with me through it all. So she rolled with me to another friend and she was like man, she's like I don't know what I'm gonna do. Man, you know, I love you and everything, but you got to slow down and she always tried to get me to see things. And she, you know, I took it to meet my mom and I really did like her, but I couldn't respect her because she let me do too much to her and get away with it, even though I liked her, got you, but she let me do too much to her for me to respect her. Wow. So, and I'm an athlete and I'm a competitive athlete, I love challenge, Okay. You know what I'm saying I don't go pick the stack squads. I want to pick this squad because we're gonna beat the good score. It's just in me for a challenge.

Chuck: 52:59

She never challenged.

Rufus Thornton: 53:00

She's the perfect one of that a man should want. My baby mom explained the best. She said when you come here, I sit here and baby kids, I sit here and get on them and ask them not to do things. And they ain't seeing you in four and five months. She said when you come here, they automatically get in line and when you leave they want to go with you. She said you know what? It is right. She said they starve us for discipline. They want that discipline. She said you just like that. She said you couldn't get along with me because I wasn't gonna have you Right, that's why she said I wasn't gonna have you coming in all type of night. She said but you can't stay away from me, can you? I said no. She said no matter who you marry, if she don't put her foot on your neck you're not going. And and I never knew that you know what I'm saying, but a woman taught me that about myself. So with this girl, she's a perfect girl, she's gonna cook for you, she's gonna be nice, she's gonna be loyal, but it still wasn't for me. So as I moved on, you know I ended up getting in trouble in the military because at that point in time I'd start going home and some of my partners over in Camden you know they now in the drug game and you know they was like getting in trouble and they didn't want to go nowhere. They where there wasn't leaving certain areas out of Cog and I'm like man, y'all ought to get out of life. And you know I was in Germany and I did this. So you want what's best for your partner.

Chuck: 54:11

Right, right.

Rufus Thornton: 54:11

And initially my intent wasn't to do anything illegal but you know, I'm a product of my environment, so this is all I know. So, me knowing my partners out in Texas, and I'm like man, I got some partners out in Texas. So he tell me I didn't even know the drug game and, like I say, I'm lame to a lot of street stuff when it comes to drug game or whatever, because I'm a country boy for real, Like I ain't been exposed to the street life. I learned a little custom from my DC partner in New York partners, how they move and stuff like that. So when my partner in Georgia like man, I just went out to Texas, man, we got these things for such a, such a, such a, and I like hi, y'all get out, that's a man. It took us all there. Who's on the great hunt? I said, man, I got a partner out there and I know my relationship with my partner is like here. Bring your tea.

Chuck: 54:50

Right so.

Rufus Thornton: 54:50

I call my partner and I like man, you know about weed, that's a man. You smoke. You wouldn't smoke with us. I mean, I still don't smoke. I never smoke drugs. Mm, hmm, I did. In my life I never did any type of drugs. So when my partner started doing that, it made me look like the man again and I'm like what that's a man? Well, you know you could do it like that. And I was like what you mean, that's a man. He brought it to me. Man, that's own. So my partner started being heavy in the dope game and I'm like cool, I ain't asking for no money or nothing, I just because you've been my homeboy all my life. You was here when I was in Cogwood, and you know what I'm saying. We used to sleep in the you know same bed on holidays. You know what I'm saying. And then when I moved to Camden, you know my partner he was, you know he done been to jail and he came back like man, it's hard to get on your feet. I'm like nah, it ain't man. So he's, you know, he's still my partner. I don't see him do good. So when my partner bringing him the drugs you know I ain't asking for nothing. I just like hey, man, take your money and so when you get out of the drug game, man, you can, you can do this, you can teach football man, he was a great football player. You can do this, you can do that. So I'm trying to instill that part in my homies, but I'm still telling my partners to bring them the dope.

Chuck: 55:50

Right.

Rufus Thornton: 55:51

I don't know nothing about financial security. I don't know nothing about credit. I was never taught that. You know I'm hearing people talk about it, but nobody ever sat me down and told me about a beacon score. Nobody ever sat me down and told me about you know, financial wealth, generational wealth. Nobody told me about any of this. We take our money, we go into the club. We keep the money, so yeah everybody, let nobody credit that can teach me about credit. I got more money than your food, so what you need to learn what I know, don't you? You? You got good credit but you broke, so I ain't gonna listen to you because I don't know what broke is. You know what I'm saying? I'm like you know that's my young ignorant thinking that at that time to have the money is better than having credit. Because I'm seeing you partner, your wife, cheating on you girl that you like down there after me. You know, so I don't understand how all this is a setup to keep me stuck. So, with my partner, I'm trying to tell him something like man, my partner, you know you can have this, you can have that. This is our business. Get a club and let's do this stuff. We're you know, you only can teach what you've been exposed to really and exercise it like that's all we know is clothes and car washes and the freak needs. So I'm like man, you buy some t-shirts and go to freak needs. To me, this big business, you know, I decided what the people that really know about credit trying to teach me. But I don't want to follow them, because I'm thinking I got money, I got a better car and you don't, so why should I listen to you? So, anyway, my partner end up getting shot, getting killed.

Chuck: 57:07

Wow.

Rufus Thornton: 57:07

It was a terrible time for me and I went to his mom and his brother's in. They would tell me like man, you go on the military. But they you know some of them are telling me how they appreciate them because I used to go and take my vehicle. I had one truck and I just say, hey man, you know you're pondering on him. Man, he just be sitting down up under the tree and I go home and like what's up with you and he be like man, oh no, man, I got this job but they fire me because I couldn't make it. So I would leave him my truck and I kissed the bus back to the post in August of like five hours.

Chuck: 57:35

Wow.

Rufus Thornton: 57:35

I said, man, just keep my truck. You know cause? These my partners I'm, and people tell me, like Ruth, as you always doing for people, but you can't save anybody, but you don't have nothing to show for yourself. And I didn't see it like that, cause I grew up in a town where I can go eat at 50 houses and nobody didn't care. And you know, we all was together and I grew up like that. So I'm like you can actually make it like this by just loving people and just doing for people. It works. Like you, you're going to be all right, but the people have to want it for themselves. So my partner even though he had a truck, he didn't want to transition into anything that I was trying to tell him because he was like me. I was stuck on stupid because I couldn't separate from the things that made me feel like I was something, even if it was the wrong way of doing it, but it made me feel like I was something Right. And that's manipulation by a lot of people that wanted me to stay stuck. So when he passed away it's been started to change and I was living in Albany and right before I got the military I got back with the girl that I had, the baby's own. That was in Augusta and I started doing escorting services. I told them to call me D12. Since 12 years old I wanted to dance contest, so I used to call it. D12 entertainment. We'll go to Miami and we'll go all around and I was still in the military.

Chuck: 58:46

Oh, you still in the military, okay.

Rufus Thornton: 58:48

Yeah, and that's yeah. I backed up because I was still with the girl and then when I was so, we went to doing it and I was going around doing these parties and I became quite popular. But the thing about it is is the girls that were there, if they have an education, I'd be like, listen, you got to get your GED if you want to strip and I know it was stupid, but I'm from a country boys, it's about trying to do right with people, but at the same time I don't know how to form a business. I just know you shouldn't be doing this and you should have an education, that's all. my mama can tell me with a fourth grade education that you need to go to school. So I saw I could teach somebody what I've been exposed to. You need to go to school. So if it's a young lady out there, they said, man, she out there doing these things and then I've been molested. So I know people can take advantage of people. So I would take girls being supplied I'm in charge of. When new soldiers come to the unit, I give them a room I'd like like a sheet pillow, um, two-pays two. You know the stuff they give you, like if you was in any other systematic form of corrections or something like that, that government, all of them pretty much the same. So I would take little girls off the street and say, hey, I'm going to put you in this room. You can't come out and when you do it has to be about 11 o'clock, but I'm going to give you a place to stay. Don't be over the mess with them people. So I used to do that in the military. So with that I had a lot of military. People knew what I was doing. They said boy, you love everybody. They said, but you couldn't lose your job. I really didn't care I was like man, you can't be on the street. And they they didn't know my reasons for not caring, cause people don't share that. They've been on this, People don't share these things they just know people act different for a reason, so it did something to me to see. So when they strip right but it shouldn't have been okay for them to strip either. But that's what I've been accustomed to and they make it seem like it's all right. But I was like, okay, y'all can strip, we're going to make money, but you've got to get your GED. So these girls became so loyal to me to wear this one lady in the military. Now I'm I'm highly ranked, respected in the military during this time, for sports, for doing my job, for loving people, for ironing my creases in my pants, shining my boots, so I'm respected. Even though I got nine children, six baby mommas, I'm still respected. So this one lady come to my party. Like I used to provide jobs for soldiers, that that if you're not doing very well financially, you can come to one of our parties and I'll let you hold a dope and if you hold a do I get your percentage of the money. So I did that and I'm a hustler. Like I said, I I create ways to generate income even if I'm in the military or whatever I'm doing. That's what we do, right? So there's one soldier that was in the military. She got with some of the strippers and strippers are civilians, but we're a military and we have your analysis. Well, she did cocaine with them. I didn't know anything about it. She came up hot and they took her rank Wow.

Chuck: 1:01:18

What an amazing conversation so far. Sorry, I had to stop there, but don't forget to tune in next Friday for part two of who Is Roof Is Thornton. You don't want to miss it, as always. Thank you so much for tuning in to let's Just Talk About it podcast, and please check out my website, justgooglelet'sjusttalkaboutitpodcastcom and then hit that subscribe button to receive all the new episodes every Friday. You can also find me on Facebook. Just type in Chuck LJTAI, which means let's Just Talk About it. So, as always, until next time, don't hold it in, but let's just talk about it. Talk to you soon.